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Post by spinaltumor on Feb 25, 2010 15:25:55 GMT -5
Alice...so you think they're all having dreams? But then wouldn't it make more sense to say the sideways are reality and the Island is Wonderland?
Narnia and Oz aren't really supposed to be dreams. Narnia is entire other world the Pevensie children stumble into. In the original Oz books Dorothy brings her aunt and uncle to come live with her permanently in Oz. Oz is a dream in the movie version, though.
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Post by mrmdee on Feb 25, 2010 15:49:39 GMT -5
I think it could go either way, but I'd be REALLY pissed if the island was Wonderland because we've been told the whole time that what's happening on the island is 100 percent real.
That's really interesting about Wizard of Oz... didn't know that.
The general problem occurs when Lindelof and Cuse say that "this is not an alternate reality" because IT IS, by definition, an "alternate reality." In Season 1, the reality is that the plane crashes because the magnetic pull of the island. In Season 6, the plane doesn't crash. There are two Jacks, two Kates, two Sawyers, etc... each with different experiences. That's an alternate reality. So if it's not an alternate reality, it must be a reality like those the heroes experienced in one of those other stories.
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Post by spinaltumor on Feb 25, 2010 17:42:23 GMT -5
Yeah, I still call it an alternate universe, at any rate. I don't see the wrong!
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Post by LockeRulez on Feb 25, 2010 21:58:48 GMT -5
The general problem occurs when Lindelof and Cuse say that "this is not an alternate reality" because IT IS, by definition, an "alternate reality." In Season 1, the reality is that the plane crashes because the magnetic pull of the island. In Season 6, the plane doesn't crash. There are two Jacks, two Kates, two Sawyers, etc... each with different experiences. That's an alternate reality. So if it's not an alternate reality, it must be a reality like those the heroes experienced in one of those other stories. What Darlton Said: - These are "two distinct timelines" - 1 "derived from a theory that when the bomb went off, exactly what faraday was postulating occured ... the bomb caused a reset" - in the second one, "juliet hit the bomb. it basically jumped them forward in time" - they do not want to use the word "alternate" anything (realities, timelines, etc) ... they are both equally real. - the will reconcile in some way specifically, they are talking about use of the ~word~ "alternate", not the concept. i think they're referring to the following definition: - different from the usual or conventional: as a : existing or functioning outside the established cultural, social, or economic system ie: our original LOST world is not the usual/convention, and LOSTX is not any less usual/conventional however they clearly missed this definition: - offering or expressing a choice <several alternative plans> And this is what i think is happening.. choices down several parallel paths, one not any less equal than another.. and more specifically, I prefer to think of this as "multiple", rather than alternative. |
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Post by gromitsdad on Feb 26, 2010 10:03:03 GMT -5
I'm looking at it more like a 'Redemption' timeline. Totally real and meaningful, but its main purpose is to show us that these 'Lost' souls have the ability within themselves to change without influence and prove MIB wrong.
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Post by warrick123 on Feb 26, 2010 10:41:11 GMT -5
Just because the two time lines come together, doesn't necessarily mean they come together in the manner in which we think. for example, i think most of us are under the assumption that we have a point A, and Point B, The island time, and the "alternate" one, respectively, and we believe that how we get from A to B is cut out.
They could be tied together in different ways, whereas they don't directly intersect or form together, but rather emotionally or psychologically they do, just not physically... it makes much more sense in my head its just rather hard to try and explain it. but basically...
Say i was born in 1990, and it is now 2010, so im 20. Say there was a movie made of my life thus far, and when i turned 5, it skipped foward to show my years from 15-20... well you don't know what may or may not have happened between 5-15, however a number of things could have happened, actually an infinite number of things could have happened, theoretically. And so, there's no way you can say with actuality that the years you see of me from 15-20 are the actual events that occurred. It kind of goes into philosophy and mechanics, with a bunch of technicalities, but if we were to go back to when i turned 5, things may have turned out differently, then if i were to just skip from 5 to 15... and so the two time lines in lost may come together cognitively, whereas we see people having deja vu, and peoples lives flipped upside (in a good way), however they don't ever remember being on the island or the events that occurred, they were just shaped and molded by their *sigh* alternate experiences, that have now set them on the right path, and so its not even really redemption, its more of... well as Jacob would put it progress. It doesnt matter how we get from Point A to Point B, whether we make no stops or a million stops along the way, those are the choices in life and the nature of free will, however eventually you will get to point B, that being death. And so without rambling on anymore or sounding any more like an idiot, the losties on island are upset that they are stuck there abiding by Jacobs wishes, if you will, when they don't, or cant see the bigger picture of how it is actually helping their lives, and Jacob does see this, and know this.
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heartreef
New Member
Flash-sideways Jack: hot, not whiney :)
Posts: 4
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Post by heartreef on Feb 27, 2010 6:56:09 GMT -5
I've been thinking about the timelines since I saw the Substitute, and trying to figure out how they can both exist. This is how I think the two timelines are distinct from one another, and both are real: Timeline A (everything that happens after 1977 – with Jacob’s interference – and plane crashes) shows the plane crashing and everything playing out as we have seen in seasons 1-5 until the bomb goes off. Timeline B (everything that happens after 1977 - no Jacob interference - and plane stays in the air) is created when the bomb goes off, negating the existence of Timeline A. Timeline C is where the losties are, on the island, since the bomb went off. Timeline B can exist because Timeline A is extinct (but still exists in the minds of the people who experienced it i.e the Losties in Timeline C) and Timeline C hasn't happened yet (for the Losties in Timeline B). What happens when Timeline A reaches the time of Timeline C (i.e. the start of season 6)  They have to merge somehow. It's pretty black and white (ha!) but that's my understanding of it somehow. Does it make sense to anyone else or am I talking garbage?! |
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Post by LockeRulez on Feb 27, 2010 11:18:47 GMT -5
i like the idea, but not sure you can negate Timeline A without violating Whatever Happened Happened. and if Timeline B turns into Timeline C, how will the island "rise" again?
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heartreef
New Member
Flash-sideways Jack: hot, not whiney :)
Posts: 4
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Post by heartreef on Feb 27, 2010 11:38:32 GMT -5
Oops, I think I means to say "what happens when timeline B reaches timeline C" - I confused myself.
I have no idea. I liked what davelewis73 said about Jacob preventing MIB from destroying the world - in this case, Timeline C merges with Timeline B (Timeline B being the only remaining timeline) when MIB is defeated as there is no longer a need for the island. I kinda doubt it though.
I can see where you're coming from - if you look at it that way, whatever happened didn't happen, but only to anyone didn't experience it. I think you can negate Timeline A, because the Losties on the island still experienced it, even if it is negated. Timeline B has just taken its place. If I have a cat in a box, then go back in time and replace the cat with a dog and relive that same period of time, I can still remember what the cat looked like in the box, because it happened. I might be talking complete nonsense (I probably am) but it's the only way I can logically (...) explain the "realness" of the two timelines.
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Post by LockeRulez on Feb 27, 2010 13:54:59 GMT -5
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Post by sweaterben on Feb 28, 2010 13:57:04 GMT -5
Sadly, I don't think either timeline is going to be "negated" or anything like that. I can say that if the "Timeline A" (in heartreef) gets negated at then end of the series then it will leave a bad taste in the mouth of the viewers. I just really don't see that happening.
As LockeRulez says, check out that other thread.
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Post by mrmdee on Mar 10, 2010 3:13:59 GMT -5
Last week threw me off a bit on this... How could Sayid still be a murdering SOB in his Fantasie Impromptu flash? He is who he is... he's not a good dude. And this week's episode? Ben gets to SAVE Alex by making a choice.
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Post by mrmdee on Apr 7, 2010 10:41:40 GMT -5
Do I get props?? "This is your deepest desire," Mrs. Widmore tells Desmond.
Everything in sideways world continues to be the deepest desires of the characters.
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Post by spinaltumor on Apr 7, 2010 11:55:06 GMT -5
But it's not...except MAYBE Desmond.
I'm fairly certain Sun and Jin's deepest desire is not for Sun to get shot while pregnant. I mean, really....
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Post by mrmdee on Apr 7, 2010 15:34:58 GMT -5
Ha! That's true. But it's also possible that their deepest desire is to be happy together. They were very happy in Los Angeles. Things didn't work out after.
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They have to merge somehow.
